Hey Arris, how about a separate Application & Utility forum? The Windows Server as a Workstation platform and its Audience almost certainly roll some specialized or what they consider 'best of' applications and utilities -- and we could all probably benefit from the discussion, experience, and analysis of the best tool for a particular job.

I have over a dozen tools, utilities and applicationsthat come to mind; some common, but some more obscure and esoteric that could get the ball and discussion rolling... You could even template the forum to keep topic posts organized like the various platform sub-forums using a topic post template like:


...with topic title formats like:

(RFD/Review) Application/Utility Name

Of course things don't need to be this formal, but a forum to separate application and utility discussion from game, and OS setup and configuration might be a nice ticket to inviting and sustaining more focused discussion applicable to our unique choice of operating system and how we maintain and use it.

Just a thought...

Aren't there already plenty of sites that do just what you described? Why duplicate that effort, especially in a relatively small community like this? Application compatibility, sure (and we already have a subforum for that), but general reviews, recommendations etc. aren't specific to R2 at all - you could go to any Windows 7 forum and the same things that are discussed there would apply here as well.

Just playing devil's advocate...

Not for the 'Server as Workstation' platform and audience.


Because it's not a duplication of effort, because the community is small, and traffic is light (understatement)... Your response is its own answer as a 'Poster Child Post' that demonstrates forum Members are bored and more constructive discussion is warrented... I can get the ball rolling, but, having moderated enough forums to know making that effort in 'Misc' sub-form category will be a wasted effort...

Of couse if everyone is satisfied with the static state of things -- you're absolutely right; why go for interesting discussion and post count that's above what you'd see on a comments section of an abandoned web page...


I'll say; it's not like I've suggested we burn you alive... On second thought...

And how is that audience different from the general 'buy Windows 7 and use that' audience? Compatibility issues are pretty much the only things that set us apart and, like I said, the forum has those covered already.

Hmm... that seems a pretty cynical view of things

Most most of the people on this forum (present company excluded) whose posts I bother to read, and whose opinions, and feedback interest me are not run-of-the-mill Windows Users...

And that is the point; I'd rather get feedback from other WaS users I know, value, trust and that can offer some real insight -- then some Geek Blogger wannabe. This is a Miscellaneous Sub-Forum exclusive to Server 2008 R2 help and issues -- starting software and utility posts here is no different then Games and is impractical for all the same reasons.


I'd say your hostility, apparent desire troll the forum to a stand still, and regard for the kind of people posting here as no different then any other Windows Users as far more cynical -- this isn't the thread you're looking for, move along...

Anyway, I posted a sample post, and will save more interesting material in the event it's welcome here or for another forum...

Heh, relax there, buddy. No need to get all agitated. I was asking a simple question - "Why?" - since what you suggested struck me as, well, redundant. But I guess you were not looking for constructive criticism after all. Sorry about that.

Au contraire, my good man. The only one giving off hostile vibes here is you.

Appearances can be deceiving. My desire is to initiate discussion, not to troll. I'm not sure why you're so mistaken about my intentions. Maybe you're unclear on the meaning of the phrase "playing devil's advocate"? If so, I'm sure a quick visit to your search engine of choice will clear it up, after which we can hopefully resume civilised discussion.

Is it not the whole purpose of this forum to reduce the difference between Windows 7/Vista and Server 2008 R1/R2 Workstation to nothing more but semantics? For all intents and purposes, everyone here is a Windows user (Server-specific compatibility issues notwithstanding, of course).

I do hope you're not somehow basing your self-worth on your choice of OS. I'm only asking because your posts leave the impression that you think this is some sort of exclusive club where "run-of-the-mill Windows Users" (whatever that means) are derisively looked down upon by those select few who have been blessed with both the knowledge and the resources required to run this particular piece of software. Because guess what? It isn't.

Your Jedi mind tricks won't work on me

I am relaxed, I'm not agitated -- it's your straw man arguments, bating remarks, rhetorical questions where you offer your own answers and are completely intolerant of exception that have me reproaching you, and I've realize too late what I've fallen for...


So simple, so innocent; except you answer all your own questions with the assumption of 'correctness' before offering an opportunity for response, and reproach the answers I do offer as unacceptable with more straw-man bullshit, and insults.


'Constructive criticism'? 'After all'? Where do I solicit any criticism? And where other then in your mind are your posts anything that even remotely resemble anything 'constructive'?


You're obviously lacking in introspective attention to what you're writing, and how you're writing it -- or are a dishonest person.


There should be no issues of 'appearance' or 'deceit' on an tech forum (unless your a marketing shill representing some interest), your statements and intentions should be explicit, not a guarded mess of jabs, bating remarks, rhetorical questions, sarcasm, and petty personalized insult under the guise of analysis.

It should be clear who the topic post was directed at; in case you missed it let me retype it here so you can see it more clearly: Arris: Application & Utility Forum? Nowhere is there any "RFD" or solicitation for discussion explicit or implicit.


Considering your choice of grammar, sarcasm, bating remarks, rhetorical questions and petty insults that till now I've politely ignored -- I sincerely doubt you are anything but trolling...


More sarcasm and insults, concealing another self-aggrandizing straw man argument; ergo I that solicited a 'discussion', want one with you, and that you have been civil.


Another assuming rhetorical question; can you possibly tolerate or is there even room in your thinking for an exception? Do I even care at this point? No. But for the sake of others that may bother to read and may be mislead; I see many here that don't have any desire to replicate the Windows 7/Vista 'desktop experience' or 'userland' and, like me have some very specialized OS needs.


More revolting, petty, bating insults, why? Have you even read why I use Server 2008 R2, the answer is on the forum. Windows isn't even my main OS 'choice'... But all things considered you probably know this already, and/or don't honestly care...


Good Lord, you're so off-the-charts with this baiting, bullshit, troll remark it doesn't merit comment beyond that...

Please, flake-off Indrek, the post wasn't intended as invitation for your trolling; in the future I'll correspond any similar intentions via PM to the intended audience directly to avoid upsetting you...

Hey hoak/Indrek,

I'm always open for new ideas that expand the sharing of knowledge and have a nice community that helps each other. However, Indrek also has a point that it isn't really related to the Windows Server operating system.

I'm planning to merge the Windows Vista, Windows Server 2003 [R2], Windows XP and possibly even the Windows 7 section into one new general Windows section, because in these categories aren't much posts anyway.

I propose we will then also add a subsection called Application and Utility Tips or something alike where these kind of posts can be placed. We 'll keep an eye on it for some time and see if nice discussions and interesting topics will come up. If that's the case we will keep the section so people who are interested can exchange tools and experiences. If it turns out not many people are interested in these subjects at this place, we will close section and move the posts to somewhere else.

Will apply these changes to the forum coming week. If you have any ideas/suggestions to these changes, I'd like to hear it!

Arris

I think that sounds good; I don't know if phpBB offers the functionality, or if there's a plug-in for it, but if there some means to flag or rename topic titles that are merged so that forum Users can tell a particular merged thread is about Server 2008 vs Server 2008 R2 without opening it -- would be very helpful, or perhaps setting a topic title policy to make it clear, and updating the topics manually... Not just an idle suggestion, if manual labor is involved, I'll help...

Re. Application & Utilities: I initially had in mind software that was rather Server, and Server as Workstation centric -- that isn't typical Consumer software like WSCC and the Utilities it deploys; but now think it might be nice if the section invited discussion and comparison of Userland applications, as there are forum Contributors that have a lot of knowledge of Windows internals that can can offer insight, so perhaps a more generic title then 'Tips'?

Lastly: the forum global link color is very low contrast for the current theme, and the forums seems to be on a version of phpBB that has an annoying post scroll bug that's fixed in later versions, there are also many security fixes in later versions and updating is usually fairly easy if you're not too many versions behind...

In that case you should have contacted Arris directly via PM, email or other private channel. When you post a message on a public forum, an invitation for discussion is implied.

But I see you're really taking it into heart that someone dared challenge your opinion. I'm still confused as to why you would totally fly off the handle like that for what really was a sincere question (and not at all rhetorical, as you claim), but since I've no desire to partake further in this nonsense, I'll be happy to oblige your request to, as you so eloquently put it, "flake off".


Arris: thanks for chiming in. I agree, merging the non-2008/R2 forums into one general Windows forum is a good idea, it reduces clutter on the forum main page. Of those, the Windows 7 forum is the only one that sees any significant activity anyway. The Apps&Utils subforum will also make more sense there, for reasons already explained. I'll be interested in seeing how the new structure works out.